The Watchtower of Destruction: The Ferrett's Journal - Dating Ghosts
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Dating Ghosts
Everybody talks about love. It comes up in late-night discussions between good friends, the kind that arrive after a good five hours of laughs and bullshit have passed. Your stomachs hurt from laughing, and either of you have the energy to keep up that "I'm doing okay" routine that most of us have running in the background, quietly informing our friends that we're not basket cases even if we're joking about it….
….And for a while, you're honest.
You sit down, turn off the TV, and get down to the real stuff — why you're unhappy with life (everyone is, at least a little bit), where you went wrong in the past, and you talk about love.
But some folks treat love with a capital "L," and it's a little scary listening to them discuss how they're going to find it.
You can see it in their eyes, a hard flinty look that tells you that they know love isn't just an emotion — it's a physical thing, a book with rules they haven't divined yet, and when they find love they'll feel it in every core of their being. They've been raised on tales of Lancelot, and they see themselves as protectors — flawed in some ways, aimless, but they know that if they stay true to their home-brewed morals the grail will eventually turn up.
"I know I'll find her," they say. "Someday."
The conversation then inevitably turns to how they haven't found her yet. Oh, they've dated, in a series of disastrous consequences. They find someone and go steady almost immediately, then cling closely because This Is Love. The girl invariably sneaks off somewhere and punctures the relationship with some sort of betrayal, and they're alone again.
"It started off well," they sigh. "I don't know what happened."
The problem is, of course, that they were dating ghosts.
A lot of people — particularly guys, but it happens to women, too — never actually see the person they're dating. The actual person they're making love to is hidden behind a shifting curtain of desires and hopes, spurred by a frantic desire to be In Love.
Because for these people, Love is forever — it's so big that it must consume every part of your being. You cannot be a little bit in Love; it's gotta sweep you up whole, man, and if you're thinking about mundane things like "Is this person really trustworthy?" or "Do we really have anything in common?", then that's a betrayal of everything Love is.
Love will heal you; if you're with the perfect person, they'll make you whole. Love will patch you up like you're a roofing project, baby, replacing those broken psychological shingles and slapping a new coat of paint on the front. Love connects you to someone, and that connection erases the problems you have.
Love is soulmates, and flowers. Love transcends the shitty little games we play with each other; if you're in love, that stuff goes away. Love is the proof that everything you believe in just goddamn works.
And you know, if Love does all that stuff, then wouldn't you be desperate to be in Love?
You know, with anybody?
So of course these people are desperate to have anyone who can find them, to start this Love process as soon as possible. But there's a tragic problem here — Love fixes things, remember? So when they fall in Love with someone, that person is mystically transformed.
You see, falling in Love with someone who was flawed would mean that well, you weren't really in Love. Love's for a lifetime, and you can't be in Love with someone who's got serious psychological issues that would, if you looked at them honestly, drive you batshit in the long run. So when your friends shuffle their feet nervously and mutter, "Dude, she kind of cheated on her last two boyfriends," you don't listen — that won't be a problem, because Love will fix it!
And when they start to realize that their girlfriend hasn't held a job in six months because she's tired of working, that's not an issue — they're a protector anyway. It's their job to ensure to tolerate as many of her quirks and behaviors as possible. If they really Loved someone, this wouldn't be an issue.
Thus, the Lovers never see the person they're dating. Any flaws they have? Mystically erased, or transformed into something they have to understand and accept. They don't see the whole person — they're dating someone whose best qualities are artificially inflated, and whose worst qualities they never even notice….
….until it's too late.
Post-relationship, another miraculous thing happens — this wasn't Love. How could it be? It failed. Love doesn't fail. Love's big-time, baby. Love's still on the train track, comin' right for them, some day. You don't know how or when she changed so drastically, but that's just something all your girlfriends have in common - they're never quite what they seemed like when you started dating them, shimmering like a mirage in desert heat.
But that's the problem. Love is fucking mundane. It's not nice to say, but love can — and should — be affected by trivial things like, say, your partner's inability to pay the rent or whether you actually enjoy the same movies. Love's largely about the little courtesies.
Because Love's not an independent process, flying high above the other emotions without support; it's held up by a gigantic pillar of Like, as in "I like who I'm married to." Without Like, everything begins to fray around the edges. The tragedy of lower-"l" love is that you can love the shit out of someone, and still not be able to trust them or hang around them without getting into screaming fights.
What saves you is like. If anything, you should be enamored of "Like," as in "If I didn't Love this person, would I Like them? Would I want to be friends with this person if she wasn't willing to be in a relationship with me?" Like should be your grail, not Love.
Truth is, you don't know whether you really like someone until you can look at them honestly as a full bundle, with both flaws and benefits, to see who they really are.
Until then, you're gonna be dating Samara. And don't be surprised at the results.
(NOTE: This could apply to three separate people on my friends' list. It's not about you personally. But you should prolly listen anyway.)
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| | I'm would like to re-post this... wonderfully written and amazingly true. xo Creepy little girl from The Ring Amen. I used to think that way, even had this Matrix-ian concept of "The One" and such similar silliness. It's much better now to surround myself with people I actually like, and squeeze as much pleasure and happiness I can out of each and every day than to pine away for romantic ideals that never really existed in the first place. It's working for me, anyway. YMMV. ![[User Picture]](http://l-userpic.livejournal.com/34157267/5598058) | | From: | katzinoire |
| Date: | August 23rd, 2005 01:51 pm (UTC) |
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| | Guess I am just Old Fashioned | (Link) |
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Since I was never a serial dater, I can honestly say that your musings on love have been through my head at least once, but I did not allow a hugely awful marriage to a bastard ruin me for life. The second guy I married was a "what if" from 1993, and we decided to see if that "what if" was worth it and it was. We did like each other as much as love each other. You probably know by now I am a widow at 32, and I am fine with never getting married again, or even dating for that matter because it would never be fair to the other person, talk about dating ghosts. But you are correct, most people want to be in love because they are in love with an ideal, not a person. My theory is just never look and believe me it will find you-I never have LOOKED for any of my relationships, they just always fell in front of me (and in Rob's case stalked me like a wild animal). Out of curiosity, what brought these thoughts on?
My theory is just never look and believe me it will find you-I never have LOOKED for any of my relationships, they just always fell in front of me
I have mixed feelings about the not looking idea of finding love and romance. It seems to be the general bit of advice given to people constantly have trouble finding boyfriends or girlfriends. Friends, hosts of radio advice shows, coloumn writers generally say "Don't look. Just do you what interests you, cocentrate on your career, etc" and eventually you will meet someone.
In many ways this seems like good advice. It probably saves people from a lot of stress and heartache ("I go out all the time. Why can't I meet some man or woman who is nice?") However I don't you can just sit on your ass and hope that romance will eventually find you. You have to look a little otherwise it could be years before you meet anyone if you ever do.
I am usually pretty busy with lots of stuff and don't have time to really look for a girlfriend. Something I have always had trouble getting. Everyone tells me "One day some girl is going to think you are nice and sweet..etc" I know plenty of women who think I am nice and sweet but it has never translated into wanting to date me. And I will be damned if I have to wait another ten or fifteen years when I am in my mid or late 30s for nice and sweet to actually translate into something.
Very well expressed.
"True Love" and "Love at First Sight" are among the more damaging cultural myths. Love is not a disembodied force that sweeps you off your feet and transports you to a higher, purer, more perfect plane of existence.
Love is an activity, an ongoing series of activities and actions that place another person's happiness and well-being beside your own in importance. Love, at its best, is when your happiness and well-being become intertwined with that of the other person, so that doing something for them nourishes you as well; and they reciprocate. And the loved one doesn't have to be perfect, they just have to be themselves.
Um..... I experienced Love at First Sight
It's real. It happens.
That said, to think LOVE is somehow this big mystical crazy glue that holds everything together is just plain wrong.
25 years we've had, and if I'm really lucky I might have another 20 with him. Maybe.
In those years we've been furious with each other. I have done countless things to annoy him and he the same for me. Ke-Ripes! I still have to SHOVE his bony elbow out of my space if I ever want to sleep...... (and yes, I mean elbow - the thing between sholder and wrist!LOL!) I have almost walked out on him once or twice and I'm sure he has had similar thoughts.
But after all that, I still laugh at his jokes and he still laughs at mine. I look at something and quite often evaluate it's worthiness by wether or not it will make him happy. If he is not here I either know where he is or I worry about if he will make it home safe.
LOVE isn't all bangs and sparklers.
LOVE is much, much more subtle than that.
Like the dragonfly that skims across a field.
If you are looking for fireworks in the sky, you'll miss the real beauty in front of you. Hey, I'm listening. If this advice had been available 12 years ago, I never would have gotten involved with my ex-wife. ![[User Picture]](http://l-userpic.livejournal.com/35672215/621056) | | From: | stoda |
| Date: | August 23rd, 2005 10:59 pm (UTC) |
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Utterly off topic, but... I love that username. ;p
On-topic... I absolutely agree with the sentiment. Culturally we've been fed this idea of "Perfect Love" for an awefully long time. You can't really blame TV or movies... it's been going on since the earliest epics and folklore/fairytales.
Maybe it happens sometimes, but so does winning the lottery - not something you should base your life around. You're more likely to get struck by lightning. today hubby is working away from home, so we do not have constant im contact. I've only been here 2 hours and already I've wanted to tell him 2 major things.
Sex and babies and sex and yep lets grow ancient together because we are perfect is ok, but talking to the old man is what sustains me on a dialy basis. I agree and talk about the "like" thing all the time. "Love" won't fix a relationship where there isn't "like", "mutual respect" and "common values"
The other part that a lot of these people don't realize is that love is WORK. It's often hard work. It's not easy to love someone all the time, warts and all. It's more effort and compromise than many people are willing to make.
~L This is one of the reasons--aside from an Austenian sort of introversion around strangers--why I only date friends. Not that friends can't have the same problems--see GSF--but it's less likely, I think. Also, nice use of Samara. This is so absolutely true.
And it's terrible to be the ghost that someone's dating.....they don't care that they're dating you, just that they're dating someone and it could be anyone really, you're just there to fulfill whatever ideas they've long ago made up about relationships. Yes yes yes yes yes yes and yes.
We sort of both did it to each other, though. Ah well. Live and learn. ![[User Picture]](http://l-userpic.livejournal.com/17472874/781617) | | From: | revdj |
| Date: | August 23rd, 2005 02:04 pm (UTC) |
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My psych professor said "Love" is not a state, it is a process.
It sounds like an empty aphorism when I write it down, but I think it is true and people would stop capitalizing the L if they understood this. Bingo! It all comes down to the fact that relationships take work, and people want them to just sort of happen. I've got a doctorate in family sociology, and my specialty is romantic formation and especially dissolution. And you are right on here.
Love that is unconditional is often unhealthy. The "romantic love complex" many people suffer from tells us that we have to be suffering and obsessed or it isn't love.
I highly recommend "Love and Limerence" by Tennov. What most people think is love is a temporally limited thing called limerence, characterized by obsessive thinking and emotional instability. It lasts an average of two years, tho each person seems to have a timetable (and it can change over time, also). Ever have a friend who finds "the one" maybe every three years? "But this one is really the one!" Limerence. ![[User Picture]](http://l-userpic.livejournal.com/14223531/1832811) | | From: | old_hedwig |
| Date: | August 23rd, 2005 02:08 pm (UTC) |
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| | Re: You rock. | (Link) |
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A year or 2 is just about right. Because then babies start coming along and you need to stop staring into each other's eyes and make a living and change some diapers. I think it's far, far worse to not know for certain whether you are a ghost or not. I've always feared that when he sees me and thinks of me, he doesn't see me, but some kind of image he's built up over the years of what he thinks I am, and what he thinks I should be. He places me on this pedestal and I worry that his idea of me is flawed. That that image of me will come toppling down. And I worry that some day, the person I love will realize he's just been chasing a ghost, and that he'll leave. And then I hate myself for thinking things like that. Because I love him, and I trust him. So yeah, I think it's far worse not to know. I agree with most of what you've said. I'd also like to add a couple things that I've found to be true. Love is not a binary state, and it doesn't stand still. Too many people have this idea that love is either on or off, and if you love somebody you will always love them. I don't find any of this to be true. Love has degrees, and those degrees will change as you change and she changes and everything around you does. Oh, and it takes work. You can't expect to find true love and then just ride comfortably on it for the rest of your life. You're going to have to put in some hours, and I mean OVERTIME. In this case the old axiom is definitely true- you get what you put into it. Yep, I've been with someone for nearly 12 years. There are days I would fucking kill him if I had a place to hide the body. I think you just pinpointed the attitude that made all of my early relationships fail....and the lack of which is why the one I'm in seems to actually be working. Only been in love a couple times, and it always had to do with a whole lot of LIKE. Bigtime commonality of interests. Huge mutual understanding. Plus, it had to be someone who treated me like I mattered.
I could never understand the whole 'looking to be completed' serial love crap thing. That's a personal problem, not love. I've run into a couple of people who tried to do it to me, and ran like hell. The male version is one date, and they want to move in together. The female is there's a wedding dress in the closet. RUN.
Then, like Tina Turner has said, there's the even worse scenario, where it's 'what's love got to do with it?' though that can apply nicely to so many things.
Like. Respect. Commonality of issues. Mutual support without codependence. Trust. Friendship. without that, forget it.
-Dira-
Ha ha! My husband (of 19 years) and I moved in together the first day we met! Of course, we weren't expecting to be anything more than roommates, but still.
I do agree with you, though. There are those who are just looking for *someone*, and they don't even get to know you because that's irrelevant.
I don't have much to say beyond, "Yes, that's exactly it". I actually am watching my partner struggle through this. I am her first real, romantic relationship and this shift from the "In Love" stage of things to the deeper/mundane love has been really hard for her. Yes, love means that I will not always pick up my shoes and put them away. Love means you can belch in front of me and not be embarrassed. Love means that we will disagree, it means also means we will find new things to enjoy, together or seperately. We won't always understand each other, and even if we generally like each other, there will be moments when we don't. That's real love, that's real life. Not this femme as Goddess on a pedastol. Put someone on a pedastol and they are bound to either fall or jump off.
I get funny looks everytime I say it, but I believe it:
Marriage is NOT about love. It's about committment. You have said so many things here that I have wanted to say to so many friends, but have never had quite the right words.
I have watched friends fall for illusions and ghosts over and over, I've told them and watched them get hurt and it makes me sad. These are tough ideas for some people to accept, the idea that this hole in them can't be filled by another person, that they have to do the work themselves is just too hard to accept.
I have one friend, she is a sweet thing, that this happens to over and over. She is very beautiful, slender, tiny, sweet, trusting and loving. Her beauty and kindness make people think they are in love with her, when they don't even know her. All they know is that she is lovely, and that she smiles at them. They don't care about her ambitions, her drive, her rightous anger, her weakness. They are surprised when she dates the man who tells her she is a real woman, that she can do it herself, rather than that she is a pixie princess on a pedistal who needs protection.
I know I want my lovers to see me. I know I want to see my lovers. In seeing their faults, their failings, only then can you really see how beautiful they are, not an imagined beauty, but a real, firm beauty. A human beauty. The kind you can stand on.
Thank you for putting so much into words. ![[User Picture]](http://l-userpic.livejournal.com/40084525/159220) | | From: | wurmwyd |
| Date: | August 23rd, 2005 02:27 pm (UTC) |
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Hi There!
My brother-in-law is a nice guy. He's had a few bad relationships, and it's small wonder. Every girlfriend that he's had since age 18 has been "The One". He goes on a few dates with them, and then proposes within the year. Wound up marrying the last one. Now they have problems, and he just can't understand how he couldn't see it.
Personally, I love Love. I also think love makes everything right. I fucking love EVERYbody. And because of this steadfast appreciation for Love, I don't understand how anyone can decide that any ONE person is THE one. There are so many wonderful people in the world, and each of them are both beautiful, and at the same time, pretty fucked-up in many different ways. People who are blindly devoted to the concept of "The One" get kinda scary sometimes.
It's actually like religious freaks. You can be a Jesus-person, go to church, put a fish tag on your car, and still be fairly realistic about the world. When you become one of those people that believe that Jesus let 9/11 happen to America because we tolerate the homos, or that your little girl doesn't need surgery because you've got your whole family praying for Jesus to restore her bone marrow, you're a little sick in the head. [nods]
![[User Picture]](http://l-userpic.livejournal.com/115254777/903404) | | | You nailed it on the head | (Link) |
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Soooooo nailed it on the head. Excellent work... this time around, I think I got it right :) I've been known to say "I like you!" to people I love, and, sometimes: "I love you _and_ I like you!"
Then I explain the difference to them. ![[User Picture]](http://l-userpic.livejournal.com/5031764/511948) | | From: | kyburg |
| Date: | August 23rd, 2005 02:35 pm (UTC) |
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If you want to Love, you have to pick someone you can fight with. Get mad with. Because if you can't, it's not Love.
And that's my two cents on the issue. ![[User Picture]](http://l-userpic.livejournal.com/12667727/587486) | | From: | mdlbear |
| Date: | August 23rd, 2005 03:28 pm (UTC) |
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Good point. I always say "be good friends first", but it's part of the same thing -- if your friendship can't survive the inevitable disagreements, your love certainly won't. We sometimes alarm our kids when we argue; I'd be alarmed if we didn't. ![[User Picture]](http://l-userpic.livejournal.com/401637/264986) | | From: | leduck |
| Date: | August 23rd, 2005 02:39 pm (UTC) |
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This rings very true in my experience. I have many friends who are focused on being "in love" rather than "loving" someone, and can't really distinguish between infatuation, which is loving their image of a person, and what I think of love, which is loving the actual person you're with, both bad and good.
Big-L love is used to justify putting up with a lot of unacceptable situations. It's one of the reasons that I do not put love at the very top of the list of what I want in relationships. Respect, trust, good communication, and good friendship are all more important to me than love in a lasting romantic relationship, although I certainly want love in there as well. Without these other qualities, love simply will not last, or be tolerable if it does. I want the whole package-- I don't want to "settle", and love alone isn't nearly enough. Respect, trust, good communication, and good friendship are all more important to me than love in a lasting romantic relationship, although I certainly want love in there as well.
But, aren't the things you mentioned components of real love? Or am I idealizing again? |
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