I'll tell you what. We can claim a tie on this one.
um... no. Really, we can't. On one side, you have impossible, without continuing divine intervention at every generation for which there is no visible evidence. On the other side, you don't. Again, as faith: no prob. Good to go. No issues. As science: not buying it.

I'll acknowledge that it would be hard to repopulate the earth if you give me that it is just as improbable that in ONE miraculous mutation the chemicals in the two chambers of the firefly's ass couldn't just came into being at exactly the right proportion as to NOT blow his butt to pieces.
Ah, this would be the watchmaker argument, otherwise known as the "it's just too unlikely!" argument.

Regardless, the probability of this having worked out is exactly one, which is to say 100%, which is to say, it's already happened. Q.E.D.

Presumably I don't need to outline the obvious evolutionary pressures against fireflies evolving with exploding asses.

Man, this is totally turning into a Terrance and Philip skit, isn't it?

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On one side, you have impossible, without continuing divine intervention at every generation for which there is no visible evidence.

Regardless, the probability of this having worked out is exactly one, which is to say 100%, which is to say, it's already happened.

OK. So you can say that your theory is proven by the existence of the firefly... With that logic, then I can say my theory is also proven by the existence of the firefly.

To clarify... you made 0 logical sense there.

Tell me who's believing in miracles now?

I'm done. You've passed beyond my ability to dig through this migraine and decipher what you really meant with that one.

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You're trying to use complexity as an argument for something not being possible. The framework for your challenge was intrinsically flawed, so I replied facetiously by replying to the literal question. (The odds of anything that has already happened having happened is 1.)

I said nothing about my theory having been proved by the existence of the firefly. Again, you are arguing with statements I do not make. You asked me to "concede" that something apparently unlikely was "just as unlikely" as something that's outright impossible without divine intervention, when there is no actual evidence of that as a specific mechanism. I declined to do so, because in a science context, the "unlikely but possible" is almost always more likely than the "impossible unless everything we know in all these fields X is somehow wrong."

It is possible that everything we think we know about genetics, geology, physics, and so on, is wrong, in favour of something for which there is essentially no physical evidence that you hold dear, which is to say, Creationism. However, I do not buy it. There is no science-based approach that supports it. The observable data is not there to support it, no matter how much you wish it might be; indeed, the observable data contradicts it at every turn.

And if you want to throw all that out because, as you told Ferret, you don't believe someone can be a Christian and accept evolutionary theory, that's fine - but that's not science.

That's faith.

It's different.

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Man, this is totally turning into a Terrance and Philip skit, isn't it?

"Oh, Terrence! I laughed so hard I had to fart."

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> I'll tell you what. We can claim a tie on this one.

I believe this is called the Black Knight Gambit, after Monty Python and the Holy Grail.

And I must say I'm enjoying what you're doing in this thread.

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I've never heard that name before - thanks. ^_^

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Gosh you don't know about the Invinsible Black Knight? He defeated every foe he came across unitll he met King Arthur, Arthur proceeded to cut of both his arms and leg's at which point the obviousley defeated Black Knight declared the fight a draw. Now if only my five year old would stop shouting "Come back here you yellow bastard, and I'll bite of your leg's" (teeth being the only weapon avoilable to the Black Knight by this point).
You totally have to watch some Monty Python (particularly The Holy Grail)

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