Exactly. And authors ignore that point at peril. I drop books by the carload, these days, if the protagonist isn't interesting, in that very way.

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Stephen King does this too well with his characters. I say too well because I *really* should not read horror novels, but I would get all wrapped up in his characters and end up hanging on for the ride.

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I'm in the same boat. When I read horror it wakes up.

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Just don't wind up with a ton of characters who only listen to techno and have no threshold for public humiliation.

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Thank you! Your post just crystallized a solution that's been sloshing about in my head for years.
I love that you're blogging about Clarion as you are: it's a bit Robin Hood in a way if we default to 'knowledge is power, but it's more powerful if everyone has it'.
Uh-oh, my political leanings are showing...

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That's the best advice about characters I've heard in a while. I suddenly realize why some of my characters are so interesting to others and some aren't, which I could never understand before because I loved them all.

Also, perhaps it isn't allowed, but have you considered recording these conversations? I only ask because I use a recorder (an iTalk, which fits with any large iPod) to record every voice lesson I have, especially with people I haven't met before (it's relatively normal to meet someone famous in the classical voice world and go "hey, can I have a lesson with you?"). It helps me remember all the little things they say that I otherwise probably wouldn't remember, and it's nice to listen to it again and hear it in that person's words, so if I misinterpreted it then I can hear it again and go "oh, wait, they actually said it this way". I understand where it might not be allowed (one class I had the teacher told me she was afraid I would post it on the internet, which deeply offended me, but she didn't know me), but I would consider it for the rest of your trip or any future things like this.

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I hate to get all "From one thing, know 10,000."
But isn't this just a corollary to the "Ham Sandwich Rule?"
Maybe call it the "Next Drink Corollary?"
If the character isn't interesting/likable enough to interrupt getting your next drink at a party long enough for him to introduce himself and relate an anecdote, then nuke them.
or something..

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Yeah, you do seem to talk about him more than the other authors, but I can't fault you for that because I would talk about him all goddamn day.

I'm not typically starstruck, but he's one of the few people I get all fan-girl over because Sandman re-introduced me to comics as an adult, and that was HUGE for me.

I make myself feel better knowing as embarrassing my sniffling was, there's no way it's in the top 100 of his weird book signing experiences. It's like Buffy. Sure I'm a bigger Buffy fan than most people I know, but I know I don't even rate in scary Buffy fans as a whole. There are some obsessive motherfuckers out there.

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Thank you for finding a way (or finding Gaiman's way) of expressing this better than I could.

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I just pulled his quote for my tumblr blog. I think that's brilliant. I think about plot all the time, and not characters.

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"My Name Is" needs updating when you can, dear. My heart is breaking for these characters, and has been for several panels. Please don't keep your readers hanging!

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You asked a great question, and he gave a great answer.

Thanks for posting this.

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I would absolutely ask him this question. It's not a writing style question or anything, just something that's always been bugging me about Sandman.
According to Neil (and many others), naming is everything. If you know someone's true name you have ultimate power over them. The name is the key. HOWEVER-
In the very first Sandman story we see Dream summoned to the Earthly plane instead of his sister, Death. Dream is then subdued and imprisoned for decades. How was this possible? How was it possible (in comic book mumbo-jumbo terms) that Dream was summoned instead of Death? If the *name* is everything, how could someone with a completely different name ever get summoned? That would seem to contradict everything that we've been told.

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"His name isn't Dream. Her name isn't Death."

Straight from the man himself.

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That sounds like a rather simple case of Death's real name is Klatu Varata Nektu and Dream's real name is Klatu Varata Nekti and Ash is the head cultist...

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Wouldn't it be weird for your characters from "My Name is Might Have Been" to be at a party where people are playing "Rock Band"?

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Awwwwwwkward.

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That's amazingly fabulous advice except those of us with less social skill might have a hard time following it.

Most of my time is social situations is spent stalking the one person who has said something to me. Usually, it's the first cute person that the host has introduced me to unless I get snagged in by the host's mother or grandmother. The last party I went to was for Christmas and it was family only. I didn't have to talk much (mostly because my mom had told everyone all of my business already) and I mostly just listened. Nobody I know has parties that people my age attend unless it's a child's birthday party thrown by my aunt and uncle. At that point, I'm just the weird niece that must have been adopted because I look nothing like the rest of the family (I'm not adopted, for the record).

So I guess that I'm either the wallflower that only talks to the old women present because no one else is interested in talking to me or listening to them or I'm the quiet girl that's nothing special to look at that is quietly standing around listening to conversations that the different groups are having.

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Then you need to judge on whether the person you wish you were would waste time in conversation with this character. ;0)

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Doesn't this remind you of your presidential theory? The one that states that whichever candidate you would prefer to have a beer with is the president who will most likely win. (I'm not sure whether a period or question mark is more appropriate at the end of that sentence. Correct me if you wish)

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That theory has been proven not to work in Australia, where the candidate who polled as the best to have a beer with managed to consistently lose against the one who was a better micro-manager.

Of course, voting is compulsory here. (The beer is much stronger, too, but I'm not sure that's a factor.)

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But if the character is a villain why do you want them into your living room?

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To interrogate?

It's possible to make an unlikeable character interesting enough that people will keep reading - even if it's only because they want to see him die horribly (e.g., Tony Harod in Dan Simmons's Carrion Comfort). More difficult to do successfully, perhaps, and probably not as much fun for the writer (who may have to spend months locked in a room with the character, not just hours), but certainly possible.

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Thomas Covenant. I know people loved the series, but I only kept reading the Second Chronicles to make SURE he died. :-)

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to hear doctor horrible sing?

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Hannibal Lecter is a great example of someone I don't want at my party but do want to read about. Re villains.
JeffV

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Why wouldn't you want him at a party? He's witty, polite, I think he'd be very entertaining.

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Seconded. I'd only invite people who were less polite than me, so I'd be safe.

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It's so important to make characters likable. The more you like someone, the more you care about what they're doing, eh? Thanks for this.

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I don't have to like someone to be deeply interested in them, though. The novels about Dexter (on which the tv series is based) are a prime example. He's a FASCINATING character. He's even more ambiguous in the novels than he is in the show, so he's even more difficult to like. He has zero empathy and he truly feels nothing for people. But I care about his story because he (the character) is trying hard to be so transparent about his motivations and thoughts and reasoning.

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Isn't it great when you get those fantastic little snippets that make you suddenly go, "OH! I get it!" It can be very very inspiring. :D

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"...to blog about my Clarion experience more, and it's taken me some time to decide to do it in a more personal voice..." Does it make you feel naked-in-public, the personal voice i mean?

Molière: "Writing is like prostitution. First you do it for love, and then for a few close friends, and then for money."
Except i'm sure, not quite sure but i *thought*, in French he said "like sex", not "like prostitution". I am sure he's not the first to have compared writing with stripping.

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Wow
That's a great question, and you got a clear answer that is actually useful.
Just... wow.

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Remember that you don't need to LIKE someone to find them fascinating and want to find out more about them.

The party theory is a good approximation, but one can throw a lot of exceptions at it, like the aforementioned Dexter. While his interpersonal interactions would make him a dud at a party. However, when, you, the reader, are granted access into their internal dialog they become exceedingly interesting.

Heroes vs. Villains:
Straight forward heroes should be directly engaging. The kind of people who are not only popular at parties, but often have parties spontaneously develop around them. ("Hey, Marcus is here, come on over!" Then they tell two friends, and they tell two friends . . .)

It gets more complicated with anti-heroes and the shades in between, but basically they'd be great to talk to at a party if you could hear their internal dialog.

Villains are a different animal. YEs, there are villains that would be great fun to talk to up until they killed you (Hannibal Lector, The Master, etc.), but generally an engaging villain is like a slow motion car wreck. You watch, not because you want to like them, but because their slow self destruction is sickly fascinating.

An example from Star Wars: We never meet an Emperor who was not evil. He's wholly unsympathetic, and he's already doomed. The difference is just WHEN he'll meet his end, not if.

Darth Vader, on the other hand (Episode 4-6, btw, I will not discuss 1-3), is revealed to be less monolithicly evil than he was originally presented. By the third movie we understand that he CAN be redeemed and root for him to come to the side of good, and his death is truly tragic.

(sorry my log-in failed)
-Artillery MKV

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That's interesting... and bizarre. Because I don't like the characters in most of Neil's short stories one bit. I often find them mildly despicable. But I want to read anyway.

This is true for other authors too... like Suskind's Grenouille in "Das Parfum." Likable, or even interesting at a party? Not at all. He'd be repellent and antisocial and discomforting and you'd want to get away from him as soon as possible.

But you sure as heck want to read about him.

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See what happens when I drop out of the world for a few monthes?


Getting to learn how to better craft my writing from NG would make me too nervous to actually, you know, write.

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