The Watchtower of Destruction: The Ferrett's Journal - A Question That's Been On My Mind Lately: What Books Will Survive?
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A Question That's Been On My Mind Lately: What Books Will Survive? As I get older, one of the things that I consider more is the nature of durability. Now that it's been twenty years since the songs I heard as a teenager have passed, I'm fascinated by the ones that have endured.
For example, when I was growing up you couldn't pass a store front without hearing Corey Hart's "I Wear My Sunglasses at Night" or Bryan Adams' "Summer of '69." Now they're pretty much radio C-listers, played on the obscure shows and mix CDs. But Sir Mix-A-Lot's "Baby Got Back" has risen from its goofy, one-hit-wonder roots to become an anthem, and my God why won't Rick Astley die off?
Clearly, whatever enduring qualities I thought those songs contained didn't actually exist. And there's something about those other songs that have continued to entrance new generations, even if I don't know what it is. The process of forgetting will continue - hell, it's continuing now. Given another thirty years, an entire generation of songs will be boiled down to one or two iconic hits to be used in movies to signify that This Is The 80s, in much the same way that "In The Mood" is the standard tune that lets people know we're swing-dancing in preparation to go off to fight Hitler.
There were thousands of songs made during the 1940s, mostly forgotten now except by aficionados. They just sort of vanish into the depths of Oldies radio.
So the question I'm asking is not music, but books. Namely, what books published in the last thirty years will still be read 150 years from now? If you were to ask people in 1850 whether Dickens would still be read 150 years from now, I'd bet a lot of them would have viewed him as a crude bestseller fit for the punters only. Yet he survived. Why? I'm not sure. I like him, but that's just me.
There are a lot of books I'm probably missing, but there are two recent novels that I'm reasonably sure will still be read by someone years from now, both science-fiction/fantasy works... And one that I'm not sure will.
Stephen King's The Stand PROS: An epic tale filled with memorable characters, and a surprisingly amount of philosophy and the nature of mankind. A very good snapshot of humanity as it was in the 1970s/80s, since watching our culture be consumed by plague does a surprisingly good job of summing it up.
CONS: The ending's a botch; and even King himself admits he just ran out of ideas. (Though that could just make it more interesting to debate in class.) Extremely violent and horrorish, which generally doesn't win the intellectuals over. Not currently being taught in many classes, since it's both extremely long and (as stated) gory. And the tale itself is nothing particularly new, either stylistically or plotwise.
THE END RESULT: A lot of the enduring books have been kept alive by English professors who determine that it Has Quality. I don't think they've ever really clasped Stephen to their chest, and so students won't be forced to read it, which may make the Stand fall to its own version of Captain Trips. But it may be held up by fans, who even after near to thirty years still adore it.
Orson Scott Card's Ender's Game PROS: A classic tale on loneliness, intelligence, and the nature of empathy, of a boy who's so smart he has to be used by everyone else. Every teenager feels like Ender every once in a while, and the book is saturated with a raw emotion that, like To Kill A Mockingbird, cannot be denied. It's already being taught heavily in classrooms to adolescents.
CONS: It's science fiction.
THE END RESULT: I think this is one of the few novels that can shed its science fiction roots and endure into the future, if the technology doesn't become too antiquated. Fortunately, we're not much closer to space travel than we were when I was born in 1969, so I don't think we have to worry. Sadly.
J.K. Rowling's Harry Potter Series PROS: A huge, generation-defining literary event done in the classic "quest" style of a boy who must become a man to defeat his worst enemy. One hell of a storytelling style. Vibrant characters who anyone can sympathize with.
CONS: The "generation-defining literary event" worked because a generation grew up with Harry. Amy was six when she started reading Harry Potter, and the first book was meant for her. As she got older, the books grew in complexity along with her, so she really felt like she was undertaking the same journey that Harry was - because she was!
That's great in real time, but one wonders how it's going to work when people are able to snarf them down all at once. An eight-year-old probably won't find the later books quite as compelling, and the fourteen-year-olds may be turned off by the simplistic style of the early tomes. I'm not sure how it'll go down cold to people who never grew up with Harry.
Plus, the ending is good, but not the slam-dunk finish that we all wanted, with major characters hitting the bin without much of a wrap-up. And many folks think the prose is workaday (I disagree, but hell, it's there).
THE END RESULT: I think Harry Potter has the potential to survive. It also has the potential to become something you had to be there for. And I think it's too soon for anyone to really say.
So here's my question, since I'm obviously on the sci-fi side of things: What books published in the last thirty years do you think will still be read 150 years from now? I'm sure there are a lot of books I'm not thinking about, but remember that only a handful will ever make it. What's your take?
(EDIT: Vonnegut: Forty years ago. Madeline L'Engle: Fifty years ago. Not that I don't love these authors, but I'm curious to see what's been published since I've been reading....)
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I still think The Stand is one of the best examples of well-written character development in English Literature.
Ender's Game will survive, no doubt. It's survived the last 20-whatever years, been passed around, and been held up as Important Lit by too many people for it to fade.
My husband and I were just discussing this the other night. I'm dubious about the HP series, although given the fact that Dickens is considered classic (and I like Dickens, myself), perhaps JKR's work will endure.
As for my candidates for future classics, I just hope to God that James Patterson isn't considered great literature by our descendants. :P
I agree with you on Ender's Game.
I think that either Coraline, Neverwhere or Stardust by Gaiman will stick around for a good long while.
Coraline or Neverwhere, sure. But I'm not sure Stardust has that lasting power--I mean, it's charming, but in the end, it's mostly just an homage to the older fairy tales out there (which might actually be its strong points; maybe I'm just putting it down because I didn't care for it much).
But I definitely agree that Gaiman could last awhile. How about American Gods? I'd probably pick that over Coraline or Neverwhere, and only that one because--as much as I want it to happen--it's hard to see the Sandman series being read 150 years from now. Again, I'd love it if they were, but how much staying power do graphic novels have?
(And if all else fails, there's still Good Omens, right?)
Forcing students to read a book might work against it as well. I have yet to meet a guy who didn't want to burn every copy of The Kite Runner that he could get his hands on.
Actually, that's my candidate for survival, just because high school English teachers seem to love it so much that they will never let it die. Never read it personally, but I'm pretty sure that's only because I didn't go to public high school.
For me, it was "To Kill a Mockingbird," because I grew up in Harper Lee's hometown (the town the book was based on).
I'm sure I would have appreciated that book alot more if I hadn't had it crammed down my throat from the age of 12-18.
I think it's WAY too early to tell. And not just in the "Dude, we're talking 150 YEARS from now!" way. The general cycle - as I understand it - of classic literature is A) it's mildly to outrageously popular (usually vulgarly), B) it falls into COMPLETE AND UTTER OBSCURITY, and then C) it's rediscovered by academics who promptly say "MY GOD(S)! Why haven't we been reading this all along!" And not enough time has passed to truly know what's going to fall into obscurity.
Besides, 150 years from now, fiction may be passe and the real scintillating reads will be political autobiographies. Who knows?!
As such, however, I think we can safely say that Brian Adams and Corey Hart are well on their way to being the staples of future retro-electric orchestras.
![[User Picture]](http://l-userpic.livejournal.com/40497973/951469) | | From: | zillah3 |
| Date: | April 29th, 2008 06:08 pm (UTC) |
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"Besides, 150 years from now, fiction may be passe and the real scintillating reads will be political autobiographies. Who knows?!"
...
Who's to say that the political autobiographies won't be fiction? ;p
| From: | pi216 |
| Date: | April 29th, 2008 02:17 pm (UTC) |
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Vonnegut.
![[User Picture]](http://l-userpic.livejournal.com/7390637/1242934) | | From: | zhent |
| Date: | April 29th, 2008 02:32 pm (UTC) |
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Seconding Vonnegut, but mostly Slaughterhouse Five, the rest will be footnotes, but that was his biggest work.
Madeline L'Engle? To follow in the same sci-fi-ish vein. I almost see her as the more recent incarnation of C.S. Lewis, except geared somewhat more towards girls, and more complex than Chronicles of Narnia.
And maybe it's just me but: The Beekeeper's Apprentice? Mystery-genre novel that broke out into broader reading (and onto reading lists)... and Sherlock Holmes himself has already proved timeless so I can have hope for his spin-offs... This certainly isn't in the vein of The Stand or HP but on the other hand, it's the unpredictabilty of it that's the point, right?
I guess we'll all just have to check back in with you in 150 years, see who was right ;-)
Wrinkle in Time is already on the required reading list in some schools, I'm happy to say :)
Alot of mine are sci-fi as well but for other genres I think Girl Interupted has potential. I know personally I've read it a good 20 times in the last 5 years.
| From: | jennb45 |
| Date: | April 29th, 2008 02:29 pm (UTC) |
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I don't know so much about fiction, but I am inclined to think that the modern classics will survive, Vonnegut, Gabriel Garcia Marquez, Toni Morrison, all of the Nihilistic breathren like Camus, Kafka, Beckett, Conrad (although some would argue he doesn't belong in this genre).
Gotta wonder what the future will be like though if we stop actually printing books and just publish electronically. Deep discounts combined with rising energy and transportation costs are eating into profit margains. Will it be easier or harder for books to succeed without print? Will there be too much noise since production costs will be much lower making it easier to publish more books or will it widen our options and encourage everyone to read if electronic books could be had cheaper? Or will the less fortunate be excluded since reading will require access to some kind of technology?
I don't have many new books to suggest, as those that defined my life have largely dried up, with the distinct exception of Ender's Game. The audio book, by the way, is also good. I sincerely hope that it remains a classic well-read book, as it was a great comfort to me as I was growing up.
It seems that, in our subculture at least, Madelaine L'engle's A Wrinkle in Time seems to endure well.
True, but Wrinkle in Time is fifty years.
![[User Picture]](http://l-userpic.livejournal.com/44977654/1050751) | | From: | norda |
| Date: | April 29th, 2008 02:29 pm (UTC) |
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I have no list, but this is a topic that speaks to me for two reasons: 1] I keep trying to "whip" the bad behavior of using references which will irrevocably "date" a book out of those clients who use my editorial services. It's a never-ending struggle, and my whip-arm gets quite tired. 2] I'm about to start the DRACULA project, and a perfect example of someone popular in his time and unheard-of in later generations is the illustrious gentleman called "Hommy-Beg" in Stoker's dedication.
Oh, how I wish Mr. Pratchett's works could survive 150 years and more and gain fame among the academics. Wouldn't this be a truly glorious vision, my friends ?
Some of them, yes.
But I don't think all of them are that worthwhile.
A Song of Ice and Fire. I totally don't say this just because they're my favorite books of all time ever so I'm not biased. I honestly do think they could stand the test of time.
I don't count it because it hasn't ended. We'll talk when, and if, he manages to wrap it up.
ok with the Potter books, you also have to keep in mind the ADULT cult following they have. Sure they were intended for kids, but there are just as many if not more adult readers as there are kids growing with the books. It's got potential to become the next Trilogy of the Rings imo.
That doesn't disprove Ferret's point, though. Those adults followed along with each new book in the same way their kids did, and a lot of them did it because of their kids, because it gave them something in common with them. With younger adults, it can be argued that they got into it because they were the right age when it started (I was eleven, same age as Harry, when I read the first book, and I was 21 when the seventh came out).
![[User Picture]](http://l-userpic.livejournal.com/43966342/3244201) | | From: | kudilu |
| Date: | April 29th, 2008 02:37 pm (UTC) |
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i've got input from a couple of people here, so bear with me. and i'm not going to look up publication dates, so I might be a little out of your range.
First, the both entirely serious and entirely factitious (SP?) one -
Green Eggs and Ham, Dr. Seuss There's nothing else like it out there, and i don't think there ever will be because it's too iconic. Anyone trying to copy the style will get labeled as a copy, which will just keep the original in circulation even if it doesn't stay by itself. There is nothing in it to make it antiquated, technology wise, because it doesn't have any. Beat that with a stick. :)
Now for the others - first, my boyfriends opinions.
The Belgariad, by David Eddings He is of the opinion that The Belgariad has a good shot at becoming the epic fantasy read for the next 150 years or so. It's complicated and complex enough that older people will still enjoy it, but unlike the current epic fantasy standard (LotR), it's fairly easy to understand for a 10-year old. I personally would extend the recomendation to the entire series (Belgariad, Mallorian, and the several individual books).
Hatchet (don't know author) Story of a boy who's parents get divorced. He gets on a plane to go visit his mom, and the plane crashes. He's the only survivor. He lives in the wilderness for 2 years, with only a hatchet. It's apparently written at a 3rd-to-5th grade level, and is perfect for that age group. It centers around something that is threatened and going away (wilderness), and a boy without adults around. It's classic, and will survive.
Now, we both thought the next one, but it's a little outside your time range - 1961, to be precise, though i would hope the the more recent, uncut version endures rather than the cut version that was published originally.
Stranger in a Strange Land, by Robert A Heinlein It's a fairly in-depth look at people, both individually and in groups. it looks at values and how they can shift, and gives a fairly critical look at religion. It's - compelling. And this description is from someone who has only been able to read 2 books by Heinlein - i never could read any but this one and Methuselah's Children.
Now, one from just me -
The Giver (don't know author) This is another grade-school to junior-high level book. It's about a boy living in a community where what you do for your life and, well, pretty much everything is decided by tests. The boy in question is chosen to hold a very rare position - there is only ever one, except during transition from one to the next. The position is basically the holder of the memories of life - real life, not the structured facimalie (can't spell) the community has built for itself. I can't say more about it without completely giving away what makes the book compelling.
Well, there's our 4c (because there's 2 of us)
I had to read Hatchet and The Giver in school. Liked them both at the time. I kind of saw "The Giver" as "1984 For Kids", which is fitting cause we had to read 1984 as well, several years later.
I don't think The Stand will ever make it on to any required reading lists, but King's more recent books have been flirting with literary respectability - Hearts in Atlantis, for instance. I think it's entirely possible some parts of his earlier canon will come along for the ride.
I don't read them much myself, so I can't venture a personal opinion, but I'm curious how well Eggers and his ilk will hold up.
I have some thoughts on Harry Potter. I think the series will live on IF people keep recommending it to each other. I enjoyed the early books despite my adulthood, as did many of my friends, but most of it wouldn't have picked it up on our own. It required a friend to pass it on with a recommendation.
On the child end, I think an intelligent seven-year old who picks up the first book and loves it can make her way through the later books, at a gradual pace with some breaks to read other things in between. She might stop reading them when the books get too mature for her, but can start again when she catches up, if reminded. In both cases, you need the other person to say, "you should read this".
Though I wonder how the movies will influence all this.
![[User Picture]](http://l-userpic.livejournal.com/8820035/955227) | | From: | tempter |
| Date: | April 29th, 2008 08:40 pm (UTC) |
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I tend to agree -- I read the Harry Potter books as an adult, and loved them. While the characters and subject matter get somewhat more mature, I don't think the quality of the writing becomes any more difficult, so I'd think it would still be pretty accessible to the precocious seven-year old who picked up the first book.
The fact that I started reading them while the series was in progress was a mark against it, not in its favor: I've talked to at least a handful of people who refused to start reading the books because the series wasn't done being written yet. I don't really think that there's any need to have been with HP "from the beginning" to appreciate the books.
re: the movies, I don't really know that they'll make much difference. At least, it was never the case for me with the generally very bad adaptations they used to do of most fantasy/sci-fi books (e.g., Dune.) The fact that the movies are so similar to the books may actually serve to make fewer people read the books in the future, though.
captain underpants, star wars, the da vinci code, harry potter
I really hope the Da Vinci Code doesn't make it. It's so full of factual and theological errors, it makes me want to cry.
![[User Picture]](http://l-userpic.livejournal.com/86158899/5050440) | | From: | sestree |
| Date: | April 29th, 2008 02:49 pm (UTC) |
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Most of the really important books (to me anyway) are earlier than 30 years ago like In Cold Blood, To Kill A Mockingbird, and Seven Days in May (which scared the crap out of me as a kid).
The only one I can think of that is a MUST read for the 30 year timeframe is War Day by Whitney Striber and James Kunekta. I think I've probably owned a dozen or more copies and when I lend them out they never come home.
Yet another book that scared the bejeebus out of me.
I'd ditto on War Day. And have you read the second book they did together, Nature's End? Not a sequel, but it tackles similar themes--the end of the world, although in this case, not from nuclear war, but from environmental devastation. I thought it as good a read as War Day.
I can't necessarily suggest it'll survive, but I keep re-reading Johnathan Strange and Mr. Norrell. Great character development, intricate, but understandable unique setting...it's on my all-time favourite books list.
Skinny Legs and All does time and place really well
Hitchikers Guide to the galaxy seems to still be going strong (does that fit within 30 years?)
I'd like to say Good Omens, because it's also one of my all time favourites, but it may become dated. The nice thing about it is that you CAN appreciate it as removed from The Omen, but the references are thick and heavy.
I have this sinking feeling that a shopaholic book will make it. I don't know why, maybe it's just the way I watch them fly off the shelves now.
I was thinking of JS&MN too (need to read it again, it's been a while), but really, it's been around for four years now and, well, hasn't been talked about much lately, has it? I mean, it's still there on the shelves, sure, but it seems mostly forgotten.
![[User Picture]](http://l-userpic.livejournal.com/8008457/866906) | | From: | mcsnee |
| Date: | April 29th, 2008 03:06 pm (UTC) |
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I agree with your Harry Potter points. The other thing that, to me, indicates they'll be a tough sell is that I have little desire to read them again after reading them once, whereas I'm on my sixth or seventh trip through The Stand and I've read Ender's Game at least as many times.
Some of John Irving's books have that "serious literature" quality that I think might turn them into the kind of books a professor loves to assign.
Garp and the Hotel New Hampshire, I hope. Was never too fond of Owen Meany.
Much as I detest them, I suspect that the Golden Compass books will still be around as well.
Another I hope has the staying power: Interpreter of Maladies, by Jhumpa Lahiri. Very well written, already has a Pulitzer.
Detest? What didn't you like about them? I'm curious.
Jurassic Park.
When we actually have dinosaur clones in 150 years, someone will come out of the woodwork bearing this book and screaming "Michael Crichton TOLD us this would HAPPEN!"
![[User Picture]](http://l-userpic.livejournal.com/8820035/955227) | | From: | tempter |
| Date: | April 29th, 2008 08:42 pm (UTC) |
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Better that than The Andromeda Strain.
I'll happily take dinosaurs over plague any day of the week.
![[User Picture]](http://l-userpic.livejournal.com/79328171/291983) | | From: | perich |
| Date: | April 29th, 2008 03:08 pm (UTC) |
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I'd take 2:1 odds that Harry Potter has dropped off the face of the earth by 2041.
Eh. I confess I'm biased, but I don't think that any kind of children's lit that's had that kind of impact on that many people ever fully drops off the face of the earth. There's always some parent insisting, "You have to read this." It might be more E. Nesbit than C.S. Lewis, but there'll be copies in print.
It'll probably have to be annotated, but if comics are still around 150 years from now, Watchmen will survive. Or Sandman.
Putting superheroes/fantasy aside, Maus or Persepolis.
![[User Picture]](http://l-userpic.livejournal.com/8008457/866906) | | From: | mcsnee |
| Date: | April 29th, 2008 04:18 pm (UTC) |
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Ooh, good answers. |
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